Neutral Qclass

So many fresh ideas floating around I thought I'd put on my thinking cap and pitch in, so here goes.

This idea needs more, but maybe you all can help flesh it out.

Remort QClass for ANY neutral race/class

A centrist should never aggressively pursue a neutral, only defend themsleves against neutrals.

Centrist:

Skills

Parry, Dodge, Shield Block

Dagger, Sword, Mace, Staff, Whip

Haggle

Hand to Hand

Lore

Fast Healing, Meditation

Dual Wield

Pugil

Second Attack

Spells

Dispel Good, Dispel Evil, Dispel Magic

Cure Light

Armor, Shield

Identify

Unique Stuff

Detect Alignment

Permanent affect: Centrist can see Red and Golden Auras.

Lightbane/Darkbane

Activate one, lasts 24 hours

Grants the Centrist protection from good (LB), or evil (DB)

Also adds 10% damage to the baned alignment

Let's the Centrist see hidden, invis, or camouflaged of the baned alignment

Poise

Adds -10 save vs spell, maybe some AC too

Scale of Wrath

Area damge spell harming all non-neutrals in the room

Harmony

Centrist enters a state of harmony gaining +25 to hp/mana/move gain

Harmony lasts * ticks, or ends if Centrist moves from the room it is done in

Summon Neuter

Summons a pet of equal level to Centrist

Neuter has 2 attacks and can bash, dirt and disarm

Neuter has protection based on which bane the Centrist is in

Can only have one Neuter at once

Doubt

Staple damage skill/spell of Centrist (ineffective vs neutrals)

Has a chance to silence and/or blasphemy

Overwhelm

Succesfull overwhelming will Hasten the Centrist and Slow the enemy.

Balance

Must be used on a target.

Upon success it will tally Centrists HP with the target's, divide the total

in two and distribute it equally among them, same for mana, and moves.

That's all I got so far, comments? Feedback?

uhh. can i play one please? watcher centrist unbeatablol

That skill balance would be MASSIVLEY abused. I could just see a monster char raping a centrist, then centrist "balancing" and effectively dealing all the damage the char dealt to you, back to themself.

wow over powered.

OP...Maybe...Obviously it is just a draft and needs tweaking.

But think about it, if they are beating you that bad, Balance just gets you back to even, almost more defensive than anything. Plus if it fails...You're screwed. It would also need a timer of course to not be used over and over.

So come on peeps, let get some ideas for skills/spells for a pure neutral that wants to balance out good and evil..It is pretty hard to come up with stuff.

excuse me ogre that is my friend, i am running away from this mean jerk and would like to heal myself to full, can i balance you? cool

If the ogre is your friend he is neutral, and it wont work

Sorry, this is kinda long...

The way I see it:

The skills, as previously stated, are way OP (against G/E). Another thing, is that against other nuetrals, they'd suck HARD. Look at G/E. evils are still good against other evils. still viable. goods are still viable against other goods (not that they have many reasons to fight each other). Centralists would be massacred by other nuetrals. completely dominated. So say they are introduced.

Who wants to continue playing a goodie or a baddy when a centralist can come around and demolish them without breaking a sweat? not me, thats for sure. what do i do? i roll a nuetral. bad for this class. end result: nobody rolls a centralist because they get steamrolled by other nuetrals. and so all it would add would be a cabal-style tradeoff, only this time alignment based. (i.e. how nexus is imba at one time, then they disapate and knight gets a ton of members). back and forth, back and forth. it wouldnt even matter if you limitted the amount to some extremely low number, even 1.

Also, from what I understand, there are MANY advantages to being nuetral.

1. More gear choices.

2. More lenient RP.

3. Safest of all alignments.

4. Fewer vulnerabilities (no alignment-based attack bonuses)

5. Easiest to rank (can group with either side, no sweat)

and more that i cant think of at the moment.

There are likely some very good reasons that nuetrals dont have qclasses (with the exception of druids, but then you really dont "apply" for those). Many of these more than likely escape the notice of players. And so I say trust the imms on this one.

You forgot their biggest advantage: There is no protection against neutrals, like there is protection vs good & evil.

exactly

Shrug,

I like it, very op but I like it.

I say go away, come back in a week with a more thought out plan/idea with BALANCE in mind and I'll give you some real critical feed back.

Good work anyway.

Do I have to go away and plan it out?

Ok, well you all said OP, can you give examples, fixes etc...

I figured since it is geared towards keeping the balance it would be cool to have an ability to enter lightbane or darkbane mode, but be stuck in it for a bit, maybe more than 24 hours.

I wanted to have skills based around neutrality and balance.

I figured since they get some nifty skills/spells their drawbacks would equalize it. They cannot disarm or blind or lag (except for the pet, which makes it kinda random). Also with only two attacks they can either dual wield for 4 attacks and have two defenses, or they can pugil for 3 attacks and two defenses, or use a weapon/shield for 2 attacks and 3 defenses. Altogether that is not a melee beast. They are also vulnerable to lag since they have no prot shield, and I didnt give them scrolls/staves/wands which only leaves them potions, herbs and usable items.

The seeing hidden/camo I think is important for when they are in bane mode, since their role is to combat the extreme aligns. They also have a limited weapon selection which should make other melees have options aganst them.

With a wide open array of race choices it would add an interesting dimension and replayablity, but I would maybe like to have some selectables in there too somehow.

Also being like the avatars of neutral, any neutral who deemed it necessary (maybe a bounty hunter) would be this classes serious bane. And also if the key skills/spells had a cooldown timer, it might help to make them less OP.

I will think of some more stuff over time, but I was hoping for some more in depth feedback from you players. I know a lot of people wanna see a neutral only qclass, so lets get our thinking caps on.

i will bold the OP parts, then make suggestions

So many fresh ideas floating around I thought I'd put on my thinking cap and pitch in, so here goes.

This idea needs more, but maybe you all can help flesh it out.

Remort QClass for ANY neutral race/class make it human only

A centrist should never aggressively pursue a neutral, only defend themsleves against neutrals.

Centrist:

Skills

Parry, Dodge, Shield Block

Dagger, Sword, Mace, Staff, Whip

Haggle

Hand to Hand

Lore

Fast Healing, Meditation

Dual Wield

Pugil

Second Attack

Spells

Dispel Good, Dispel Evil, Dispel Magic

Cure Light

Armor, Shield their defensive capability is already fair.

Identify lets not give them more utility

Unique Stuff

Detect Alignment

Permanent affect: Centrist can see Red and Golden Auras. lets stick to the detect spells

Lightbane/Darkbane

Activate one, lasts 24 hours 10 hour duration. causes for 38 hours after effect wears off. prevents recast.

Grants the Centrist protection from good (LB), or evil (DB)

Also adds 10% damage to the baned alignment

Let's the Centrist see hidden, invis, or camouflaged of the baned alignment perhaps give them a chance on cast when they cast detect good/evil to create a "see invisiblity" effect affecting only the chosen alignment, as well as allowing the Centralist to see through autosneak for that alignment. only a chance though.

Poise

Adds -10 save vs spell, maybe some AC too

Scale of Wrath

Area damge spell harming all non-neutrals in the room affect one alignment only. lags caster for 2.5 rounds.

Harmony

Centrist enters a state of harmony gaining +25 to hp/mana/move gain

** Harmony lasts * ticks, or ends if Centrist moves from the room it is done in** forces sleep for 5 hours. cannot wake up unless damaged. or targetted by a spell, to exlude benefitial spells.

Summon Neuter

Summons a pet of equal level to Centrist

Neuter has 2 attacks and can bash, dirt and disarm

Neuter has protection based on which bane the Centrist is in

Can only have one Neuter at once

Doubt

Staple damage skill/spell of Centrist (ineffective vs neutrals)

** Has a chance to silence and/or blasphemy** should give a 15% chance to prevent c/c from using spells. reduces physical damage dealt by 3%

Overwhelm

Succesfull overwhelming will Hasten the Centrist and Slow the enemy. grants 2 extra attacks, ignores block/dodge/parry/dual parry. lags caster and victim for 2 rounds.

Balance

Must be used on a target.

Upon success it will tally Centrists HP with the target's, divide the total

** in two and distribute it equally among them, same for mana, and moves.**

exchanges caster's mana and hp in terms of percentage. (i.e 200/1000 hp and 250/500 mana would become 500/1000 mana and 100/500 mana) caster enters after casting, preventing another exhange for 72 hours.

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i will bold the OP parts' date=' then make suggestions[/quote']

Dude, thats real unhelpful.

sorry >_>

I like the idea of a neutral only class, but I dislike the feel of this one.

I feel like a neut only class should be more melee oriented, with a small casting ability. They should definitely NOT see detect hidden/camo. Far too many classes can get "detect all" as it is. We don't need any more.

A true neutral, Neut ethos/alignment with balance religion should NOT be allowed to be in Watcher. Watcher is not about balance, they are about domination and eradication of the cities. Not a very balanced view.

I like the idea of a neutral only class, but I dislike the feel of this one.

I feel like a neut only class should be more melee oriented, with a small casting ability. They should definitely NOT see detect hidden/camo. Far too many classes can get "detect all" as it is. We don't need any more.

A true neutral, Neut ethos/alignment with balance religion should NOT be allowed to be in Watcher. Watcher is not about balance, they are about domination and eradication of the cities. Not a very balanced view.

Then by rights they shouldnt be able to join ANY cabal... Because the views of those in a cabal are always in the extreme, hence someone is willing to dedicate their life to a faction that supports those beliefs.

In that case, if they are unable to join ANY faction, they should have some OP skills IMO.... I say work on it a bit reccum, its a sound idea, just some of the skills are a little OTT.

A few of my thoughts...

Poise is basically endure, if I'm remembering what endure does properly (current ninjas or ninja fans please correct me if I'm wrong). So why not just give them endure?

Bane seems like an interesting skill. Probably the most OP in there next to Balance. I would say add in taking extra damage from the focused alignment, similar to ice/fire shield with an invoker. Might make that a touch less powerful.

Balance...I think that should be usable only if they're following you. Being able to instantly drop your opponent to half hp after they've stomped you into the ground, while it might not win the battle for you, would absolutely screw your opponent. (I can foresee people stalking centrist battles just to take a crack at the opponent if balance gets used) Also, potentially give it a battle timer similar to quitting/entering guilds, though that might completely remove any usefulness to the skill at all.

They also definitely need something against neutrals. While it would be interesting to have neutrals be a bane to these...with the current setup I agree with everyone else, other neuts would absolutely stomp Centrists.

Think

So many fresh ideas floating around I thought I'd put on my thinking cap and pitch in, so here goes.

This idea needs more, but maybe you all can help flesh it out.

Remort QClass for ANY neutral race/class

A centrist should never aggressively pursue a neutral, only defend themsleves against neutrals.

Good idea, why not. There are psi's as a neutral quest class but no real neutral only quest class.

As **MUDDER **previously mentioned, coupled with the idea of Reccum that to join a faction would push these characters out of their intended RP is nothing but brilliant. As well as not allow them to attack any neutrals at all, for walking the balance means walking the balance.

Im all 100% for these ideas. It would give a boost to some **Player Run Clan ** ideas. As well as the possibility of becoming a noble who rules with an even hand or a herald if you can rp it right. NOTHING wrong with that. (Or you could be an avatar of balance who must recitify the unbalances within the world.)

However due to this fact (non cabal acceptance) I'd suggest that they do pack a punch when they are ready for it. But as previously states some of the skills are a bit over the top. Let me break it down for you and make some suggestions.

Centrist:

Skills

Parry, Dodge, Shield Block

Dagger, Sword, Mace, Staff, Whip

Haggle

Hand to Hand

Lore

Fast Healing, Meditation

Dual Wield

Pugil

Second Attack

• Current Skill Thoughts
• I notice there is no Third Attack listed here ( that only allows for a maximum of FOUR attacks when dual weilding, hardly what I would call over powered.)
• Only Three defenses total, using that dual weapon will greatly reduce your defense so any half melee character will make this out of the question.
• Pugil is an interesting choice for some more offense and defense, still I notice no TWO HANDED skill which should make things a little more difficult and not really give the ussual defense/offense bonus.
• Hand to hand, fast healing, meditation, haggle - just standards fair enough.

Obvious things missing (could be good or bad)

• A way to blind! No weapons and no way to blind? Bit harsh.
• No way to disarm? And we are crying they are overpowered?
• No blind fighting? This is looking worse and worse for the over-poweredness.
• No two handed - as already mentioned.

Suggested Additions:

• Maybe some sort of anatomy skill? But based on good and evil (only through victorious combat can you learn upwards (but cannot ever be removed/unlearnt)
• As well as normal anatomies? Give them some sort of edge I think.
• Think about that blinding/blind fighting thing, thats a biggy.

Spells

Dispel Good, Dispel Evil, Dispel Magic

Cure Light

Armor, Shield

Identify

MY THOUGHTS:

• The dispells are good, staple skils for the class.
• Without blind fighting or a way to blind DISPELL is a MUST.
• Cure light is NOT enough. Cure serious AT LEAST with the amount of damage I can see them taking.
• Armor and shield is good, stone skin and flesh armor added aswell I think.
• Identify and Locate - you need them both.
• add recall teleport or portal, you need something here.

You will notice there is no:

• Flight for protection from trip
• Enlarge or Shield for protection from BASH
• No recall, teleport or portal.

Still overpowered?

Unique Stuff

Detect Alignment

Permanent affect: Centrist can see Red and Golden Auras.

A good staple skill for the class.

Lightbane/Darkbane

Activate one, lasts 24 hours

Grants the Centrist protection from good (LB), or evil (DB)

Also adds 10% damage to the baned alignment

Let's the Centrist see hidden, invis, or camouflaged of the baned alignment

I'd say this work like a skill already in the game and dont tell me its over powered because its bloody well not and you all know it.

Have the enemy recieve more damage when the right protection is used as well as the QCLASS recieving less damage from them.

HOWEVER: If they attack or are attacked by someone of the wrong protection they will recieve MORE damage and DEAL less to their opponent.

Poise

Adds -10 save vs spell, maybe some AC too

I'd say make it add some hit/dam too. It'd just be like a slightly stronger warcry. Nothing too over the top.

Scale of Wrath

Area damge spell harming all non-neutrals in the room

Sounds fine, could work out badly if used in the wrong area. Also will be USELESS for most mob killing areas as most of the common ones deal with neutrals.

Harmony

Centrist enters a state of harmony gaining +25 to hp/mana/move gain

Harmony lasts * ticks, or ends if Centrist moves from the room it is done in

Sounds good, like a sort of mental/physical camp. Have them cancel it as they wish but up the +gain to the same as camp. Can be sustained for as long as they want but have a TIMER on it, unlike camp. Once every 12 hours or something.

That'll bring a bit of strategy into the mix.

Summon Neuter

Summons a pet of equal level to Centrist

Neuter has 2 attacks and can bash, dirt and disarm

Neuter has protection based on which bane the Centrist is in

Can only have one Neuter at once

Ok blockable attacks with the possibility of some sort of lag and blinding. Not too bad. They probably die as quickly as ranger beasts and are half as powerful. No biggie there.

Doubt

Staple damage skill/spell of Centrist (ineffective vs neutrals)

Has a chance to silence and/or blasphemy

I imagine this to be like a clerics ray of truth or path of deciet. Dealing decent damage with added effects. Maybe have the **chance to blind **in here with this skill if its the staple?

Overwhelm

Succesfull overwhelming will Hasten the Centrist and Slow the enemy.

An interesting idea, so let us consider:

Fighting a mage:

You are dual weilding.

You will gain a couple of extra attacks around from haste.

Your opponent becomes slowed (yeah thats bad for a mage.)

Any self respecting mage will tell you being slowed is the perfect way for an attrition win, you will not run out of mana, you will heal like a demon, and you can just keep chipping away at the bastard. Thats 100% rough.

Fighting a Melee

You are wearing a shield and a weapon.

You'll now attack somewhere between 3-4 times.

You still do less damage (melee) then any melee with dual weild and 3rd attack would do.

Your attacks are still blockable.

Your enemy has more defenses then you do.

They get slowed, still they could attrition you to death, or if all else fails run away or dual weild for higher output. It is not that hard, happens all the time to melees fighting any self respecting Bmage.

Lets not forget they can LAG you, to which you are helpless beisdes your AC and your dex. Great.

My thoughts would be to give them the haste and the slow spell out right, hell it'd be more useful then this OVER POWERED skill...

Balance

Must be used on a target.

Upon success it will tally Centrists HP with the target's, divide the total

in two and distribute it equally among them, same for mana, and moves.

This is really the only skill I have problems with. It doesnt work... Imagine reducing an invoker to half mana? They'd flare themselves to death in the first round (especially if you dropped their health).

This skill needs revising somewhat or scrapped altogether.

CONCLUSION:

1. IF you all actually LOOKED at the skill list and thought, youd see they are actually VERY underpowered. I would NOT be putting in the hours to get one as they are.

They cannot blind, or defend blinded. They cant disarm but be disarmed/shield disarmed. They currently have a crappy heal and a limited knowledge of weapons.

This limited knowledge and blindness would be the end, doesnt matter how much damage your LB or DB was taking off.

2. They have very little to help them from high spell damage, warriors have the offense as do berserkers, clerics and otehrs have other magical means of dodging the damage. These are just begging to get owned.

3. I still like the idea, but like I said, they still need a bit of ideas and work, atm as I see it they are a bit underpowered and underserving of the time and commitment they would need to gain one. (think this vs a vampire or lich or sader... Yeah right.)

Lastly, think before you jump on the over powered band wagon. Just because someone else says it doesnt mean its true. USE YOUR OWN GOD GIVEN BRAINS FOR A CHANGE.

Aulian, thank you!

Finally someone who looked the class as a whole and realized as I did immediately that the class is not OP. I'll post again in a few days when I've had a chance to think about it a bit. Cuz it definitely is incomplete.