Idea to balance the overpowered tribunal

That's because it was daytime and he was all out of vials.

Dey

Hahaha

Only thing I don't like about tribes now is that that damn guard helps them if you are wanted or not, and well if you think about it all cabals have guards that help weather you are against their cabal or not. So my argument is pointless.

Not all cabals have guards. Warmaster doesn't, and I don't think savant does either.

Only thing I don't like about tribes now is that that damn guard helps them if you are wanted or not

Not true. Justice charmies used to autoassist against everyone at a certain rank in the cabal; Tribunal charmies do not.

Half of the cabals have pets, J. Twendrist.

Not true. Justice charmies used to autoassist against everyone at a certain rank in the cabal; Tribunal charmies do not.

Depends on who you ask, mine never did.

Believe it was Elder Sentinel. Not sure, though

It was Elder..

And really, Trib charmies don't assist against non-wanteds? Even For Martin? ..I thought I saw it helping him out.

If he was attacked, it did.

Sorry for post

Sorry Chayesh, my post was not meant to be a whiner of one. It was meant to try and help or see what could be done if anything.

If you're non-wanted, don't use area spells while assaulting the tribunal, or else get prepared for the guard jumping on you as well.

And you think that tribunals are overpowered? Then why in the hell my thief condeathed so quickly? You think that I'm THAT bad? Then why I was Trib in the first place? My main problem was that ppl knew where to find me, so they came for me prepared. I RARELY got the upper hand.

If you can't beat the vampire, dont get wanted. Same goes with bounties. Aint it simple, huh?

And Warpnow, you aint gona win anything with that whining. You're only showing that you don't know how to, and instead of learning how to, you're crying things to be changed. And if Chayesh actually chances something to satisfy you (or anyone), I'd be VERY disappointed on him.

Warpnow, instead of crying here how the vampires are overpowered sheep, I play to learn how to kick their ***. Even when they keep w00ting me with one or two rounders always, and it do feel damn frustrating. But trick is, that I've learned something, some of it even useful against other (non-vampire) characters. Some day I'm gona kill a vamp with thief.

Now, can YOU muster same sort of dedication, instead of this "bhoohoo"?

Messalantha actually gave me a few pointers against fighting her once, IG and RPly with Velyhn. After she slew me about three or four times, she was talking about how I was little challenge for her hunt, and told me to come back with a staff. I did much better, and got her to around quite a few/big nasties, as opposed to barely scratching her. On the way back to my corpse she told me she wanted to play a game with me, and to check my corpse. I had been full-looted, but she left a sack with a few sanctuary wands/staffs inside. She then told me to suit up, and to come and find her as opposed to letting her hunt me. Something about not wanting to waste her breath chasing a poor challenge I think.

I still died, but suffice to say the difference between my first and last battle with her was unbelievable. Those are all pretty basic things of course, but it's the little things together that help against them. It taught me that hindsight is a wonderful thing. Even the logs where I have been three/four rounded by a vamp have taught me something. But I don't want to say what, because it's my secret theory.

Again, I'll say it again, because the main seems to be about Marty giving everyone a good rogering: Marty has died in 1v1 combat, which means he's not invulnerable. And I think Tribunal are fine. I didn't before, but having chance to observe as well as fight with them with a couple of different pinns.

Like I said before, I have my theory on vampire killing. And it's a bold statement coming from a non-vet but I'm willing to bet this theory works. I'm willing to be an Outlaw over it, because I'm going to try it on all vampires. What if the theory doesn't work, and I get rocked over? I'll log my battles, and read the logs, and gleam what I can if anything. Again, the consensus appears to be that the most powerful Tribunal at the minute is Marty. If Marty has fallen in 1v1 combat, then that means he is not infallible. Which means he has been defeated. Which means he can be slain.

Some characters in the past that have 'owned' the base have had their classes/races toned because they've been overpowered. I'm not saying that's the case here, but at the end of the day it's down to Imm judgement. If the Imms think it's fine, I have no reason to believe that they'd be far off in their decision. And that leaves me two options: Play lawfuls/neutrals, or pick up that damned blade and learn to fight. I'm going to choose the latter, because I love playing chaotics and I'm not going to let some poncy blood-sucker spoil my fun.

Dey

Here, here.

Perm 100/100 hit/dam for you* for that well-stated post.

100/100 hit/dam usable only at night....on water...with a duergar.

I'd still take 100/100 with a Duergar on water.

I just can't wait to see the posts when we see the first Tribunal Lich.

Dey

If you're non-wanted, don't use area spells while assaulting the tribunal, or else get prepared for the guard jumping on you as well.

And you think that tribunals are overpowered? Then why in the hell my thief condeathed so quickly? You think that I'm THAT bad? Then why I was Trib in the first place? My main problem was that ppl knew where to find me, so they came for me prepared. I RARELY got the upper hand.

If you can't beat the vampire, dont get wanted. Same goes with bounties. Aint it simple, huh?

And Warpnow, you aint gona win anything with that whining. You're only showing that you don't know how to, and instead of learning how to, you're crying things to be changed. And if Chayesh actually chances something to satisfy you (or anyone), I'd be VERY disappointed on him.

Warpnow, instead of crying here how the vampires are overpowered sheep, I play to learn how to kick their ***. Even when they keep w00ting me with one or two rounders always, and it do feel damn frustrating. But trick is, that I've learned something, some of it even useful against other (non-vampire) characters. Some day I'm gona kill a vamp with thief.

Now, can YOU muster same sort of dedication, instead of this "bhoohoo"?

Where exactly do I "whine"? And wow, you don't know anything about me. You think I can't tough it up?

You think I don't know how to fight a vampire? Any other Vampire than Martineius I have had some really good fights with/killed. I have fought most of the vamps that FL has had, actually.

And why does me making an argument that a class is overpowered mean I have no dedication?

And no duh a thief couldn't make it in trib without hiding. That is common sense. You have to be eite to have a trib thief. Its a hard to play combo, because anyone who wants to find you can, and you don't stand a chance against many of the classes.

And last time a rogue took down a vampire it was a ninja, and after they did it, ninjas were toned down.

I wonder if people forget that the staff also plays mortal characters and has no doubt have had their own share of tangles with the tribunal so they know how overpowered and scary the Tribunal really are?

They've said "not going to change" yet people continue?

Theyve all taken deaths, a few have condied so im failing to see where this vast well of unbeatable power lies, save within the hands of skilled players so unless you want to go to peoples houses and start breaking fingers so they can't kick your *** I'd suggest people hike up your boots and soldier on, cause with the sob story attitude people will be to bent on griping and moaning as opposed to understanding the nature of the beast to bring it down.

I don't think Tribunal's are overpowered at all, and I have had more than one outlaw. It isn't tribunal's that cause most of the problems, as they can be beat. I don't agree with certain qraces being in tribunal, but there is no reason to bitch about it. I just think it's a combination of things. Outlaw, Tribunal powers, fear. I think most of you get so antsy about fighting someone like Martineius that your skill(if any at all) goes out the window in a mad dash trying to "survive" instead of "kill". You end up fumbling instead of planning. Tribunal's have weaknesses, especially Martineius. Catch him at the right time, he can be beat. No it won't be easy, it will be a pain. Martineius has a damn good player, playing him.

I was on the other day, there must have been 4 outlaws on. Martin logs on, outlaws log off. Amazing. Instead of using power in numbers(not saying gang him) you could have easily beaten him. I was in the Marine Corps, obviously you don't care, but I learned things like, "Personel mines aren't meant to kill people, they are meant to maim them. That way it gives more of a fear effect on the other marines, considering their friend is screaming bloody murder with their legs blown away." Which can be said for people like Martineius, if more then one outlaw is on, and he is chasing after one, he will have to be more cautious, and watch out a little more for the other one's coming at him, which in turn could make him fumble and make mistakes. Offering people chances to beat him.

On a differant note, I think you people who sit here and say, "Don't break the laws if you don't want to get outlawed/wanted" obviously have no real sense of role play. Some characters actually roll play a chaotic person who doesn't take the laws into consideration. It's hard to role play that simply because of tribunals, just like it's hard to role play an undead because of Watcher. Or a Nexus because of Knight, or vise versa. But people still do it. This is all just my opinion, I'm sure some if not all disagree.

On a differant note, I think you people who sit here and say, "Don't break the laws if you don't want to get outlawed/wanted" obviously have no real sense of role play. Some characters actually roll play a chaotic person who doesn't take the laws into consideration. It's hard to role play that simply because of tribunals, just like it's hard to role play an undead because of Watcher. Or a Nexus because of Knight, or vise versa. But people still do it. This is all just my opinion, I'm sure some if not all disagree.

That is said in reply to people who choose to play their characters in a chaotic manner, who get spanked for doing so then come to the forums to play out their greek tragedy for the world.

I think Weasel's correct, but Zavero makes a good point, too.

If I can correctly clarify at least what I have said when saying 'Then don't play outlaws' (with THEN being the operative word in the phrase) is that if you are getting tooled and want to come whine about it, then don't play outlaws. Everyone keeps justifying their need to play chaotics with talk of RP freedom, etc. Great. I hope the reason people are playing chaotics is for RP reasons and not "let's go kill Martineius, et al Tribunal". But to make one, get stomped, and then complain because you can't win that you are somehow being taken advantage of or cheated due to an alleged overpowered cabal prompts me to respond with "Then don't play unlawfuls since you obviously aren't hacking the RP responsibilities for it". It's the same thing with any class, race, align, cabal, qrace/qclass, i.e. aggressive healers, goods killing goods in direct PK, evils grouping goods, opposing cabals grouping together, overly aggressive neutrals, cabal members who won't defend, Tribunals who refuse to capture criminals, etc. Making your own choices freely and then crying "Foul" when things don't go as you planned them and then further jumping to the incorrect assumption that the game must change to meet your demands/expectations is completely illogical reasoning bordering on the ludicrous. Everyone who uses RP as their justification for playing chaotics needs to walk the two-way street of accepting readily the consequences of that choice.

I'm remembering something about heat and a kitchen.

It's not that we don't hear the complaints. It's not that we don't care what the players think. It's IS that the complaints heard are usually inaccurate and self-serving and usually have something to do with a personal problem with Tribunal and are thus not typically constructive or nothing more than "I want it my way and can't have it that way" whining and thus viewed as nothing more than sour grapes.

Woot for chayesh! I agree totally. If you can't hack it...don't hack it at all.