Nexus and Syndicate can coup, and that's it. I submit that perhaps Barbarians ought to be able to coup as well. It falls in line with their RP quite well, I think.
Coup
A coup, while in its literal meaning is used exactly by militaristic organizations, IMHO, in FL it has a bit different meaning, especially considering that it's often used when your opponent is hurt and unsuspecting. A coup, having the meaning of backstabbing an already hurt victim so you can overthrow him and gain his position, has no place in WM.
No matter if its Gladiator or Barbarian, both organizations are supposed to have honor and desire for perfection as their main virtues, so I find your suggestion a bit odd.
That being said, I've always thought about some kind of "duel of honor", where a candidate can challenge his superior and the result would be similar to coup. Attacking your superior while he is unaware and most likely hurt though, is everything but warmaster-like.
A coup does not necessarily have a clandestine context. Alphas struggle amongst themselves to see who is the strongest. Such is the natural order of things. Barbarians would seem to be right in line with this. The strong survive. The cream rises to the top.
As we are speaking of warmaster, It is beyond me why a ninja cannot be a warmaster?
I'm inclined to agree with your idea f0xx, makes sense to me from an RP perspective. Coups, as you mentioned, are generally a chaotic upheaval, whereas warmasters are about honor in battle.
A coup does not necessarily have a clandestine context. Alphas struggle amongst themselves to see who is the strongest. Such is the natural order of things. Barbarians would seem to be right in line with this. The strong survive. The cream rises to the top.
Exactly my point.
In a coup, a weaker individual can defeat a stronger one by using surprise and very well picked moment, which is exactly against warmaster's ideology, even barbarians. In a duel that can rarely happen, since both parties have time to prepare.
As for ninjas, I tend to agree. We've had ninjas in WM before and I would love them to be listed as able-to-join class. They should even be considered the same way thieves are, when in gladiator.
Then perhaps couping in Barbarian could be initiated through a type of challenge? Like an overthrow?
Then perhaps couping in Barbarian could be initiated through a type of challenge? Like an overthrow?
It really lacks incentive for the higher ranking Barb. If he loses, he loses rank which can be just friggin annoying to attain beyond T. If he wins, he won a challenge which is nice but doesn't exactly do much to uplift you.
Should there be incentive to do your job and prove you deserve the rank and not someone else?
It really lacks incentive for the higher ranking Barb. If he loses' date=' he loses rank which can be just friggin annoying to attain beyond T. If he wins, he won a challenge which is nice but doesn't exactly do much to uplift you.[/quote']
That's a problem, yes... but incentive can be created through different ways.
The bigger problem is that most of the time those duels simply won't end - what stops an elder from just running away and leaving if he sees he is going to lose the duel? Of course that is OOC as well, concerning warmaster RP, but doesn't solve the problem.
And the other thing is, do we really need a "couping" system for warmaster?
Also, Valsgarde, remember what happens to a person who fails a coup?
That's a problem, yes... but incentive can be created through different ways.
The bigger problem is that most of the time those duels simply won't end - what stops an elder from just running away and leaving if he sees he is going to lose the duel? Of course that is OOC as well, concerning warmaster RP, but doesn't solve the problem.
Leave Tongar to administrate his cabal? It'll work just fine. If there are higher ranking barbarians that are just being cowardly, I'm sure it'll be dealt with appropriately.
And the other thing is, do we really need a "couping" system for warmaster?
More than we need damage or -1 dex for an hour for going to sleep mounted. And it makes sense for Barbarians to overthrow someone who isn't as strong as they are.
Also, Valsgarde, remember what happens to a person who fails a coup?
Yeah, why? I feel like you're trying to point me out for something here. I've never tried to coup anyone, and I'm 2 and 1 for coup attempts made on me, and the 1 was Zrothum and I was naked.
Leave Tongar to administrate his cabal? It'll work just fine. If there are higher ranking barbarians that are just being cowardly' date=' I'm sure it'll be dealt with appropriately.[/quote']
Don't know why you keep thinking this is about barbarian alone. Barbarian and gladiator RP is exactly the same when it comes to honor. Other than that, you're probably right. I just don't like the idea of introducing a system that can and will inevitably create more prayer posts, especially such that need Tongar's attention, considering he is our only active coder.
More than we need damage or -1 dex for an hour for going to sleep mounted. And it makes sense for Barbarians to overthrow someone who isn't as strong as they are.
Can't argue with that 
Yeah, why? I feel like you're trying to point me out for something here. I've never tried to coup anyone.
Just asking...
Don't know why you keep thinking this is about barbarian alone. Barbarian and gladiator RP is exactly the same when it comes to honor.
Because it is about barbarian alone. The RP is similar, but it isn't the same; that's your personal spin on it. This manifests in such simple ways as barbarians being able to smoke drugs and gladiators abstaining. When Lytholm was the WM imm, one of the WMs I had was a barbarian blademaster. He was hanging out with us in the Fort, and we were all challenging each other and fighting, talking trash, having a good time, and I challenged a gladiator halfer ranger. He won the dice roll. I was already prepared, and being evil, and a barbarian, I attacked him immediately. I three rounded him, was immediately promoted to Trusted. The ranger wtf'd, and Lytholm was like, "...He's a barbarian, what did you expect."
I just don't like the idea of introducing a system that can and will inevitably create more prayer posts, especially such that need Tongar's attention, considering he is our only active coder.
How often honestly will prayers from this come up? Sure, it'll happen, but you make it sound like it'll be an all-the-time thing, and it won't. There aren't many WMs and haven't been many for a long, long time.
Of the few there are and have been, how many of them are:
*Barbarians
*Barbarians ambitious enough to try to overthrow a higher ranking Barb
*Barbarians who would try and fail
*Barbarians who would try and fail and cry about it
Not very many. Several a year, if that.
He won the dice roll. I was already prepared' date=' and being evil, and a barbarian, I attacked him immediately. I three rounded him, was immediately promoted to Trusted. The ranger wtf'd, and Lytholm was like, "...He's a barbarian, what did you expect."[/quote']
I'll stop here. That's just wrong, and just because the IMM that happened to lead the cabal then agreed with it doesn't make it right.
It's been stated many times that just because you are barbarian you ain't allowed to act trashy (i.e. without honor). Concerning honor, barbarian and gladiator ARE the same. Their difference only comes from their means of combat, barbarians being more lax and "rough" about it and gladiators being more self-reliant. What is in actual need is a more clear help file to define that.
That reminds of Bali's old Tribunal who decided that just because he was evil, he could mark people without them actually breaking the law.
It's been stated many times that just because you are barbarian you ain't allowed to act trashy (i.e. without honor). Concerning honor, barbarian and gladiator ARE the same. Their difference only comes from their means of combat, barbarians being more lax and "rough" about it and gladiators being more self-reliant. What is in actual need is a more clear help file to define that.
I just fundamentally disagree, and given that the then-acting imm supported it, I'm inclined to say that I was right. What constitutes "lax" and "rough" and how it differs from "dishonorable" is a slippery slope, and one that I think the imms are doing a fine job without either of us telling them how to do it.
But I digress. Barbarians should be able to overthrow weaker barbarians with higher rank!
I just fundamentally disagree, and given that the then-acting imm supported it, I'm inclined to say that I was right. What constitutes "lax" and "rough" and how it differs from "dishonorable" is a slippery slope, and one that I think the imms are doing a fine job without either of us telling them how to do it.
But I digress. Barbarians should be able to overthrow weaker barbarians with higher rank!
Agreed and agreed.
Actually, anything Warmaster, be it Barbarian or Gladiator should be able to overthrow a weaker superior, especially when there is a disagreement. The process should follow the warmaster virtues though, not a coup.
Should there be incentive to do your job and prove you deserve the rank and not someone else?
I don't roll dice if there isn't something in it for me. Granted, I likely have a financially suppressed gambling problem.
I challenged a gladiator halfer ranger. He won the dice roll. I was already prepared, and being evil, and a barbarian, I attacked him immediately. I three rounded him, was immediately promoted to Trusted. The ranger wtf'd, and Lytholm was like, "...He's a barbarian, what did you expect."
if that.
I was that halfer ranger glad. And needless to say, I was NOT happy. I was under the impression that all WM's, Glad or Barb, were supposed to have honor. Apparently Lytholm didn't agree with me. 
IKFL
You call it dishonorable. I call it unrefined, uncivilized, evil, or barbarous.
If I killed you, or took something, it'd have been dishonorable. But I didn't do either. And it was a friendly duel between WMs and we were all talking trash.
The altered content of that quote was unnecessary. -Elro
Keep it classy, San Diego.